PLZ Critique

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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby seabas22 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 5:49 pm

Lol...thanks! I've actually shortened my FH backswing quite a bit compared to earlier form where my elbow would go completely behind the shoulders which often lead to nose issues. I'm not sure about shortening much more or going to the side, but I'll experiment some. I know that when I've tried to throw mechanics wise the way Ville or Big Jerm does it hurts my elbow and shoulder. My mechanics style just seems to be naturally more like Geoff Bennett and Ricky Wysocki. I guess there maybe a difference of whether Ville is talking about the foot or the knee/hip(leg). I know on standstills my rear foot stays down, but I think once I add forward momentum the rear foot will come up. I think how wide a stride makes a difference of whether the foot stays down otherwise I would think submarine pitchers would keep the foot down. I know I can still feel a big difference of my footwork between FH and BH and the FH leverage is still much better. Maybe I need to start doing some lefty hockey slap shots.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby JR » Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:10 am

I understood Ville to mean that the disc has left the hand before the rear leg foot comes off of the ground. That has very clear physics reasons. The arm chop power gets partially dissipated by the chop rotating the body back if the back leg is off of the ground. Or you could counter that motion the Feldy way. Effectively you halve the elbow chop keeping the rear leg airborne and you also lose big time in the body rotation meaning your arm lever force multiplier ain't driven at full power. Limiting turning speed limits power generation divided by the factor of the arm lever at full power/the factor you achieve with the leg off of the ground. The resulting number ain't pretty. Who has too much power to waste away? Maximum efficiency as a goal in the form or go home. There is no good reason to not go large and if you don't do that don't leave the house. There is no excuse for pussyfooting and jumping hoops in the throw -only maximum efficiency is allowed for best results and if you don't aim for that you lost the game in your head for the entire career before you left the house.

Toe dragging is too far gone Avery Jenkins type of finishing with the toe on the ground. You gain a foot in keeping only the toe on the ground getting the foot vertical at the rip. That way the leg muscles aren't stretched as much trying to keep the foot on the ground and you ensure better weight transfer also lengthening the distance the rear leg pushes forward generating more speed. See the dual angle slo mo vid again on Youtube channel mfranssila. See where Avery's rear leg toe is both FH and BH at the rip?
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby seabas22 » Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:41 pm

BH Blizz Boss 450', FH Star Xcal 400'.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby JR » Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:10 am

BH looks like as it has been. Both ways of throwing have similar leg work issues. You got the hips engaged somewhat with the FH throw but the shoulders were at neutral relative to the hips turning with the hip action and leg work alone. You could get the elbow farther forward. You are weight back with the arm pit above the center of the thigh with a loooong plant step.

You have put in a lot of thought and practice work into technique and still not changed much. The rear leg is airborne but not countering the arm straightening. Sapping power. I'd like you to do this drill for both FH and BH. Jump a few times forward with just one leg -the rear leg of the throw you are going to do next. For each of the following drills try to get the hips and shoulders move fast and maintain an upright posture (you tilted forward at the hips meaning your core posture keeping muscles were too loose). See if the hips and the shoulders add power and change timing into faster and if you can get the elbow farther forward. It is hard to feel how it works with so many things to monitor so video is a great help. Then try a stand still delivery with a lower stance with more knee bend angle than before say 100-110 degree angle between the shin and the thigh keeping the rear leg on the ground during the throw and the follow through. Then keeping the rear leg on the ground past the rip then lifting it up to step forward in the follow through. Trying to push only forward not up with the rear leg and confirming a less higher or equal than knee heel height in the follow through. That means you need to push harder and more forward level with the ground. Standing up to the toe helps in maintaining ground contact and adding a little power. The next stage is to take the x step and maintaining the heel at or under the knee in the follow through then a run up with the same deal.

Shortening the plant step should help in engaging the hips and the shoulders not sliding forward instead of pushing with the rear leg like you do now. Meaning the rear leg is providing only a part of the power it could into the throw.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby seabas22 » Fri Sep 06, 2013 2:29 pm

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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby JR » Sat Sep 07, 2013 3:07 pm

Have you tried to brace harder with the right leg in the plant step? To lengthen the pause and delay the foot pivot. The left leg kick seems to vary in height and direction. Some of them look like a good way to counter the arm swing AKA the Feldy kick.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby Flipflat » Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:19 pm

I like the bird's eye view, I've watched that vid a few times just to learn a little.
I would like your X-Wasps, please.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby seabas22 » Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:16 am

JR wrote:Have you tried to brace harder with the right leg in the plant step? To lengthen the pause and delay the foot pivot. The left leg kick seems to vary in height and direction. Some of them look like a good way to counter the arm swing AKA the Feldy kick.

I think I've come to a similar conclusion that I need to brace harder and stop/redirect more of my forward momentum of the spine/shoulder. Going through the throw in the pool I feel more bracing to release the arm and my off arm ends up going more backward like GG and Avery and I also notice my posture ends more upright in the finish with the rear hip more forward, in the water I feel more like GG in slow motion. I was throwing mostly slight hyzer on those throws. When I do pure hyzers with a more left to right x-step my rear foot stays down lower. When I x-step more from the right to left my rear foot comes up.
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Re: PLZ Critique

Postby JR » Tue Sep 10, 2013 6:13 pm

Throwing pure hyzers means that the arm is most likely moving down to up and your aim is high so it is natural to stay more weight back in the thought process. When low hyzers can still be thrown with the disc moving at constant height and weight being shifted well forward. Sideways differences in running direction have different weight shifts and the arcs of the body turning and legs moving into the follow through step are longer going from right to left. If one took as long a follow through step with hyzer running from left to right as one would take with right to left movement one would kick the left leg high and probably fall down on the back or the back of the head :-)
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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